My mom had around $800 000 of chequing and investment accounts. Can the power of attorney for his will assume control of our mothers estate? I have survivorship of this account. Thanks again! I also used the C$ account to pay out the interim inheritances last year. If you are a co-owner with right of survivorship then the assets become yours automatically upon death and are not part of the estate. That sounds wrong to me. I was told we can't do this unless we have a probabated will. Hi lynne,My mother passed away in late October. most of her property was gifted to me before her death. Do you mind if I place your article on my blog and reference your site to it?Cheers,Larosabelle, Hi Larosabelle,Thanks! Financial institution (Questrade) refuses to do so and claims this is against the law (True?). The category names can change to accommodate the estate activity. They are saying they'll transfer it once you meet their requirements even though they are making that impossible.Consider making an appointment with the branch manager. My 29year old son died suddenly. Neither happened. Hoping you can answer my question. investments of 25k held at multiple institutions), is it right for the bank to request probate for the operation of the estate account? I had Mom's bank card as she always had me use it in the stores because her dementia was getting worse and she was too confused to use the interac or bank machine. Lynne. Is it legal for my mother to deposit that cheque into that joint account.? This seems to directly contravene the CRA website for these types of accounts. Any advice you may be able to offer would be appreciated. My sister agrees that my father intended the investment account was to be shared equally between my sister and me. Just be sure to keep detailed records of what came in and how you used the funds so that you can explain it all later.Lynne, My mother was killed suddenly and although she requested I be her executor she neglected to sign her will properly. Hi Lynne, I had POA for my mum, who had dementia. at which point the funds will go to Estate. must i wait for court probate? The will called for my sister and I to each receive 45% of the proceeds and the other 10% would be distributed evenly among my sisters two kids and my two kids. Hi,I'd like to know if it is absolutely required for an estate account to be made.My grandmother passed away and there are only two beneficiaries, my mother and I. Dear Lynne, I live in Ontario. She lived in a Retirement Home, there was no property or investments and just over $2,000 in her account. The other is to ask the funeral home to wait until the house sells. My question is does the bank have to wait for the probate to go through before selling the investments? I have dealt with two CIBC staff and have been promised a CIBC Manager but no Manager has yet contacted me.Is CIBC correct in making asserting they are making lawful requests identification of beneficiaries and for requiring each and every beneficiary to appear at a CIBC branch, identify themselves and completing account application forms? Yes, J Gilmore, the account can have automatic debits, but usually the estate doesn't have recurring payments for things for very long. The bank now says I have to wait 6 months before disbursing to beneficiaries. If they still won't comply, you will probably have to hire a lawyer to write a letter to them for you.Lynne. The money belongs in his estate, which has to be used to pay off any debts or taxes he might owe. Getting a Taxpayer ID Number From the IRS. Once you are proven to be the executor, the bank has no control over what you do with the money because they bear no liability. Do I just carry on as executor of the will or should I be administrator? CIBC requested personal ID documentation for each and every beneficiary on the account which I supplied although I was hesitant to believe the Money Laundering Act actually requires it. I recently received a cheque from my dads estate made out to me and "in trust" to my daughter. I would like to reference your site to them. If you go to the bank that cashed out her account to you, they may agree to cash it, simply because they know you, and they know that you are the executor. I can completely sympathize with your situation because I have my own ongoing battles with banks' legal departments on my client files.Whether or not the people at the legal department can read the signatures, the judge of the probate court could, and did. The 1st distribution I picked up from a lawyer as I was in a hurry to get money. For the 1st distribution she sent it herself to my brother by courier. The last bank draft amount is large of course but way under 100K as in total that's approximately what each would get after taxes and expenses. You don't have to wait for anything but the cheque to clear. My sister lives in the same province as my deceased father. She was living with me and we have a joint bank account. The banks have always agreed to this (with only one exception) because the funds aren't going to the executor or anyone else besides the court. Banks' legal departments don't get their hands dirty with actual customer contact; they make sure you have to go through the front-line bank personnel who have no authority and can only convey messages.Am I frustrated? My mother died in Feb 2017 and her account was at RBC. You can open an estate bank account after initiating probate and petitioning the court for formal recognition as executor or administrator. The house had a secured LOC on it and we handed over the keys after telling bank no more payments would be made on LOC. Thanks! Score: 4.6/5 ( 43 votes ) Using an estate account can help keep the deceased's financial matters separate from an executor's personal financial matters. If the assets you have mentioned in your note are the only assets in the estate, you do not have to probate the will. I also wanted to be sure her remaining bills were paid (less than 1K).In July I received a notice from one company that the account had been sent to a collection agency. He had no assets. This might not matter if the funds are held for only a very short time, but if they are held for longer, an executor is expected to show an investment return. All Canadian banks apparently have their own rules regarding estate accounts and probate. The judge has discretion to deal with the will. Without more facts, I don't know for sure that this is what they are getting at, but there should be no bank policy to say an executor must wait 6 months. We need to access funds to pay final funeral expenses, property tax, and more importantly estate taxes so we can begin probate.How we do access the funds? You probably will not need to go through Letters of Administration just for one vehicle (depends on various factors).Lynne. Hello Lynne, If an executor is aware that the total value of an estate is over $100k, but values are from multiple sources (i.e. Estate Plan: A written document that outlines an individual's strategy for the disposition and administration of their property at their death, incapacity or total disability. Yes, I would expect that you would have to obtain probate to deal with the account, due to the high dollar value. You may have to show some of these to justify your expenses in the future.Generally speaking, executors don't have too much trouble with the expenses as long as they really do keep them reasonable.Note that while the ability to repay yourself applies to expenses, it does not apply to your executor fee.Lynne, I also meant to add that you don't have to ask the bank to issue your repayment. Hi Linda,The cheque should be written to you as executor, as the lawyer has suggested. I asked to see the documents and they refused to show them to me and also refused to give me a contact name and number of the registered office because I am not a member of the credit union. Will i need a letter of administration to open an estate account or will my bank let me sign a letter of indemnity? Our mother had her checking and an investment account with them. I went into the bank again and asked to see her but she was in a meeting so another representative took my name and number. Hi Lynne: Great and informative blog.My husbands uncle died recently. What can I do? I was then told a few months ago that it reverted back to the estate because the change was made too close to her death and I have been asking for answers on this for months and finally received a reply that there were more recent documents that changed it back to the estate. The alberta bank is insisting on probate. I've heard and seen horror stories from every bank and credit union.Note that I'm not talking about the trust company part of the banks. It's now over a year since our relative's DOD and delays are almost all due to the executor's actions or lack thereof. I was told in the beginning the less money in the account the easier it will be to close out I have a felling this isn't so. If you haven't wound up the estate in a year and there is no good reason for it, you could end up in a dispute with the beneficiaries and possibly in court.Lynne. Is it really the case that I can't get this information if the PEOPLE aren't available? On her demise this account now shows as mine but of course it really belongs to all the beneficiaries. My three sisters and I are the beneficiaries, however my mother had no assets and lived with us. Srnicek said most brokers predict interest rates will continue to rise in the first quarter of 2023, with the first Bank of Canada announcement on the key interest rate set for Jan. 23. There could be a problem with it, or there could be a newer one, or for some other reason this might not be a good will. Is there a time limit on how long an estate account can stay open? We also offer guidance on tax strategies to maximize your family's wealth over time, managing assets, setting up trusts, and developing estate plans that cross jurisdictions. Do they have this right? To open an estate account, you need to go to the bank and request that they open an estate account. The executor will also need to . This declaration that the bank has mentioned are they getting that from somewhere? Ever.The executor must wait along with everyone else for the estate to be wound up to get his or her inheritance.Either you are mistaken about the financial obligations of an executor, or I'm reading your question incorrectly. Can I relinquish my claim as beneficiary and have Empire Life send the money directly to my 2 brothers, thus avoiding probate? Absolutely unacceptable.You said that "she" sent funds from "her" bank account so I assume that is his wife. Giving Power of Attorney Will the cheque clear as normal when cashed as I thought accoubt were automatically frozen when someone passed away. The bank had a copy of the will and death certificate .. now what do I do with these cheques I recently got? I am also the executor and there are also 3 monetary gifts and the rest is divided up between her 3 kids. Both my sister and I are in high income tax bracket, while our Mother is retired and would be exempt from any taxes. The bank at which I wish to open an estate account for my late brother insists on cutting cheques to his beneficiaries and dividing up his money right away. There were no investments just bank accounts in both our names, (my father and mine)so the money could pass seamlessly in the event of his passing. My mother's will has her 3 children as executors. Thanks. We were able to open up an estate account at the Bank of Montreal and transfer the funds from her account without going through probate. All he did was tell the banks that she had terminal cancer,(one bank employee stated she was told, he was consolidating my mother's assets, she called their lawyer, who told them it was okay to give him the money) and they released the money, prior to her death. I contacted CRA, MCP and Service Canada to advise them of Mom's death and filling out the appropriate forms. What purpose it serves would only be a guess on my part. Well, I posted the above,on July 16tth along with the other person who also had issues with Royal bank on July 8th. Learn more here about here about Estate accounting and the right to receive accounts Executors must account for the estate, and beneficiaries are entitled to receive, review, and challenge the accounts including any compensation claimed by the executor. They can object to them if they think the expenses are inappropriate.To protect yourself, keep all paperwork such as receipts, cancelled cheques, work orders, bank statements, etc. Bank Accounts Notify the bank and identify yourself as the executor. There are 5 of us siblings and my 4 siblings have all agreed that I would take care of Mom's account. She had no idea if I was a TD customer or not. Sure he had a will but most of the time the banks will want the will to be probated or other supporting paperwork to be provided. Estate Planning. Not every will is probated, and the banks are well aware of that, particularly if some of your joint assets were held there. There is enough money in the account to pay the lump sum payments and still cover any surprises that may come up before final tax clearance is issued. Meanwhile my brother received it but I did not. Isn't it the point? There is nothing else to pay out now. Should we be concerned? i have a will, am the executor, and can open an estate account if necessary. Use any other estate funds you have been able to gather, such as the CPP death benefit or the sale of household contents. An Estate account is a different kind of account - it is a new account opened after someone has passed away, into which the Executor deposits the deceased person's money, from which the Executor pays the deceased person's debts and bills, and from which the Executor ultimately distributes funds to . I don't have the big picture! As I said, not all banks are responding properly to the change in the law (from 2007) and some are paying out joint bank accounts between parent and child to the child. My father had a joint investment account with my sister with a right of survivorship which held shares and cash which the bank has put into her name to deal with as she sees fit. Or, if the primary account holder of your joint bank account has recently passed away, we can assist you in determining your entitlement, if any, to the account assets. In reading their most recent annual report, the office of the ombudsman outlines the complaint process and time for resolution. You'll have to make sure the whole story is told to the court in your application for probate. The money belongs to the beneficiaries, and they have every right to insist that you disburse it (once taxes and bills are paid, of course). Hello Lynne,My mom passed away in January of this year and about 7 months before that she changed beneficiary on her investment account and TFSA from the estate to me. My husband recently died before he could receive (as sole beneficiary) money from his mother's estate who had predeceased him by 2 years. You are the executor and you need to get control of this situation. If it's not going to the named beneficiaries, then it has to go to the estate and be taxed. If I am the sole executor and beneficiary and receive a bank draft in the name of the estate of the deceased, can I simply deposit the bank draft in an estate account and then withdraw funds from the estate account since I am the sole executor and sole beneficiary. Probate is slow because her state pension came from UK along with a small occupational pension. Do I still need an estate bank account?Thank you,Tammy, I doubt you would need one, simply because there won't be anything to put in there, or anything needing to be paid out of there. Still to this day I have not heard anything. She asked each bank was this a problem, each said it was not a problem. If a CRA refund is the only asset in the estate, talk to the bank and ask if probate is really necessary under the circumstances. My sister now refuses to sign a bond of indemnity to the bank to have it replaced even though I went as far as convincing the bank to put my name on the bond too, which they don't have to. I am in the process of opening an estate account for these commissions to go into and need to know if the funds will be accessible to me for paying bills & mortgage etc. Based on your comment in the second paragraph, how would this apply to funds held with a financial institution in an investment account?If I am executor of my father's estate, and he had an investment account of $500,000, does the financial institution have to pay it out to me as executor if I instruct them to?Isn't it basically standard practice for them to require a probated will before they will liquidate an investment account?Thanks. We have updated this page to reflect the transition to the 2021 version of the National Occupational Classification (NOC).This means that the occupation "estate secretary" was moved from the group Legal administrative assistants (NOC 1242) to the group Legal administrative assistants (NOC 13111). By the way, I checked out your site and it's really unique and interesting.Lynne, Is this a special category of account at the bank or can one just open a regular bank account with the name on the account as you've described above. This is because a grant of probate is an order of the court that indemnifies everyone who follows it. HI Lynn, My case is very complicated,it started with the land my mum bought 5 acres of land in Fiji and she got her first cousin Vana to handle things to sell the land which mum got many offers even for $450,000.00 but mum trusted her daughter-in-laws family the lawyer she hired and her cousin in Fiji.when our beloved mother passed away notary Sublock Sublock never even got mum to sigh her Will even though we paid $170 fee for that one home visit Mr.Sublock refused to help us and we sent mum's old Will which was Notarized and the Fiji Courts refused to accept it and my dad was next of kin now they said Vana and fiji lawyer Ulamila Tuipuku said that my dad needs to do a Probate and I sent $3,500 for court/lawyer/probate and months down the road Vana and Ulamila said that the court won't accept the Probate that they wanted her in my Dad's WIll which he "WE HAD A DEAD LINE OR LOSE THE LAND " we said that was crazy and we went through with that and so so and we went through Mr. Sablock again because he had the history regarding the land and my mum's information etc.My dad wanted to sell the land because there was squatters on the land and two churches was already built on land without permission and you wonder who was minding the place.When I made an offer to a performance on the land Vana was so upset she was yelling and I said okay you have 6 weeks and she said she already had the money and we'll we waited and waited for the paper work.When I tried from May 2012 til Feb 2013 to get the lawyer to send papers yo sell the land she was making all kinds of excuses and we sent thousands of dollars for court cases and the land .The thing is after my dad passed away the first thing Vana said is remember that I'm the excutor on the Will and no one can go above me and I was do she said none of your kids can go above my head and this just to show she knew what she was doing .We'll after all that she said that the land is in her name and the lawyer who was supposed to be working for my dad was working for her and went against both my parents. In such a situation, the funds in a joint account would then transfer over to your child, who can then distribute the funds according to your wishes without having to go through probate. Will probate be necessary for this? They told me I would be able to get a bank card and on-line access and cheques once I had provided them with a CAET. Earn a limited-time savings rate with the Momentum PLUS Savings Account 7. I felt there was no need to probate. TD bank says it can take "two, three sometimes even six months" to set up an Estate Account for me. It will be the job of the estate's executor to set up and monitor the account. As of today's date the bank has yet to release the funds and they keep asking for such things as my identification etc., which was I had given them already. Thanks in advance for your input. Make sure you have provided everything they asked for. FIL was not natt8ed, Julie, what does "FIL was not natt8ed" mean?Lynne. The estate or other eligible individuals may be entitled to Canada Pension Plan death benefits. Hello Lynn,Is an executor allowed to pay expenses out of the estate account prior to probate being granted? Once the letter of probate has been granted and presented to the bank where the estate account has been set up, does the bank have any further right to "approve" payments coming out of the estate account. In our case the executor says she has to await the Grant of Probate before opening an estate account. The information contained in this report references market data from MLS boards across Canada. Thanks! The loan would be repaid with interest before the final disbursements. Two witnesses, however, signed the will as witnesses and swear that the maker of the will (now deceased) made the will, and somehow no one noticed that the maker did not sign it. I think I have been reasonable, but am now also very unsatisfied by the response by the ombudsman's office and told them that when they called yesterday to 'loop back' on my complaint. I am not happy with RBC at all. Received his last Canada Pension cheque, issued in the month of his passing but am unable to cash it. When they are one and the same person, the executor must only use the estate funds to pay estate costs and debts. When will the bank require some action on the account? We represent both estate trustees and beneficiaries deal with this crucial part of the estate administration process. It is not unusual at all for a bank to insist on having a grant of probate before releasing funds. Unfortunately, what you are trying to do is completely against all estate law, which is based on the documents that exist, not the documents that might have existed or could have existed.Your father left the RRSP beneficiary form with named beneficiaries. It is a normal bank account that is opened in the name of the deceased person's estate. CIBC had no problem setting up an estate account on provision of the will; RBC would not do that without probate. If Empire Life insists on issuing a cheque to the estate, are they at all obliged to reimburse me for the probate fees I will have to pay on the money (300K) because they made a mistake in allowing the account to be set up that way? You must pay all debts (and it sounds as if you have done so) and taxes, then whatever is left must be divided among the beneficiaries.Lynne. What is your question? However, you can call and enquire if you don't want to make a special appointment with a banking representative. Yes, you should should go to the bank to set up an estate account, and no you shouldn't need probate to do that. The things people will do to their own parents is absolutely appalling. Even the bank manager was surprised they had no mechanism to inform clients. His RRSP beneficiary form completed in 2011 lists my sister and me as his beneficiaries (oversight). I have had a couple cheques come to me for the estate. As a result, few executors know, relying on the issued (or not-issued!) Will I have to fly to that province to sign the cheques or is there something that is sent to the bank to release the cheques with only one signature? Banks drive me nuts, for exactly the kind of thing you've just described.Lynne. My question is can someone replace him without electing a new executor? My sister had a joint bank account with mom and after she passed, took my moms name off the account. After it is all said and done the money will be divided between all 5 of us. But the underlying question is -- what to do with this situation of having no will. Also consider the fact that when a lawyer holds funds in trust, the interest earned on the funds is paid to the Law Foundation and not to clients. 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Executor says she has to go to the named beneficiaries, then it has to await the grant probate... Releasing funds for you.Lynne be taxed and filling out the appropriate forms an account. If it 's not going to the named beneficiaries, then it has to used... Do so and claims this is against the law ( True? ) her account was to used! For exactly the kind of thing you 've just described.Lynne to reference your site to them for you.Lynne used C! Sure you have provided everything they asked for checking and an investment with! That the bank and request that they open an estate account or will my bank let sign...
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